Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull, Buddh International Circuit, 2012

Villeneuve criticises Vettel in Italian magazine

F1 Fanatic round-up

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Sebastian Vettel, Red Bull, Buddh International Circuit, 2012In the round-up: Jacques Villeneuve tells Italian magazine Autosprint he is supporting Fernando Alonso and believes Sebastian Vettel is not as cool-headed as his Ferrari rival.


Top F1 links from the past 24 hours:

Vettel reacts like a child – Villeneuve (Autosport)

“Alonso remains calm, cool, and rational, while Vettel most times gets upset, angry, screams and flicks the middle finger. He reacts like a child.”

The interview was conducted by Autosprint but their website repeatedly failed to load for me when I looked for the original article.

Sebastian Vettel will be at Red Bull in five years, hints Christian Horner (Daily Mail)

“Sebastian has been involved with Red Bull since he was 12 years of age. His only successes have come with Red Bull. He feels comfortable in the environment. He trusts in the people and we’re bringing the best out of him as well and he is happy”

Aktuelle Vorabmeldungen (Die Zeit, German)

Daimler Chairman and Mercedes-Benz Dieter head Dieter Zetsche says his F1 team must improve.

U.S. Grand Prix, ready or not, it’s time to race (AutoWeek)

Circuit of the Americas partner Bobby Epstein: “I’ve never been involved in a venture where we have to sell tickets. Will people buy them? And if they do, will they come? And if they come, will they have a good time? I’ve never had to worry about that before.”

Renowned racing doctor to head COTA medical centre (Austin Business Journal)

Dr Steve Olvey, who spearheaded advancements in safety during his time working for CART and Champ Car, is the chief medical officer for the United States Grand Prix. His book Rapid Response is a excellent read which includes a fascinating account of how Alex Zanardi survived the crash at Lausitzring in 2001 which severed both his legs:

As F1 race approaches, critics see traffic, trouble and outrage (Austin-American Statesman)

“It?s impossible to know how many people think Austin would be better off without F1. They tend to be more vocal than those who are merely irritated at the inconveniences the race will bring, such as traffic and noise, and the accompanying downtown extravaganza.”

Lewis has been practising for US GP… on his PS3 (The Sun)

“I?m made up we?re going back to the States. I?ve only driven the track on the PS3 and simulator ? but I think it?s going to be a track that drivers enjoy.”

Westboro Baptists Hate Formula One (The Austin Chronicle)

“Innovative hate-monger Fred Phelps is unleashing his offspring and assorted ill-wishers on Austin.”

The Star Spangled Grand Prix (F1 Speedwriter)

“In Detroit the hope that some of the imported European glamour and sophistication would revitalise the inner city’s urban blight was sabotaged by those in the F1 press corps who dubbed the race ‘The Murder City Grand Prix’ and suggested that sounds of gunfire might drown out the engine noise.”


Comment of the day

Roger_E doesn’t go along with Martin Whitmarsh’s view that the recent changes made to F1 will make it more appealing to American viewers:

The thing to remember is that over here we already have NASCAR using artificial things to spice up races and those who don?t like the artificiality of NASCAR have always tended to look at either IndyCar or F1.

As a result those who turned away from NASCAR for using artificial things will almost certainly not like F1 trying the same.

From the forum

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday to Loki and Tom Watson!

If you want a birthday shout-out tell us when yours is by emailling me, using Twitter or adding to the list here.

On this day in F1

Gerhard Berger won the Australian Grand Prix for Ferrari 25 years ago today.

With F1 heading into its final season with turbo engines this marked the final race for two turbo power plants.

McLaren’s TAG Porsche units had been hugely successful, powering 25 Grand Prix wins, three drivers’ championships and two constructors’ titles.

However the Motori Moderni engines used by Minardi had been conspicuously less successful, failing to score a point in their 44 appearances.

This was also the last race for a BMW-badged turbo engine, though the company later returned to F1 and their turbo engines were badged as Megatron the following year. Here’s an onboard shot from the Brabham-BMW of Andrea de Cesaris as he blasts out of the pit lane at terrifying speed in the days before they were restricted:

Image ?? Red Bull/Getty images

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  • 137 comments on “Villeneuve criticises Vettel in Italian magazine”

    1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
      15th November 2012, 0:08

      Horner tries to dismiss vettel-going-to-Ferrari rumors, but I think Vettel’s staying or not will depend on the car they can bring by that time. If they are still on the top, why should Vettel move? If not, if Red Bull becomes “McLaren 2012” he should flee as quick as he can

    2. Seriously who CARES what JV thinks. He’s almost as annoying as Niki Lauda.

      1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
        15th November 2012, 0:18

        It’s just an opinon. I think all drivers have reactions depending on the heat of the moment. Remember that at the end of the Abu Dhabi race in 2010, Alonso yelled something on Petrov, when the Russian was just defending his right to be there.

        Or Coulthard and Schum in Spa (well I think it was the opposite, Schum reacted on Coulthard right?)

        Probably some people with good memory can even mention some JV reaction.
        Besides that, JV got just one title and Seb has already two, so yes who cares :P I’m just joking I respect his opinion but I disagree with that

        1. On this bit:

          Vettel… flicks the middle finger

          Perhaps my memory has failed me but I can’t recall him ever actually doing this. He seems more fond of his index finger than his middle finger. In a manner of speaking.

          1. I think he gave Narain the middle finger, but yeah, aside from that I can’t remember either.

            However, 2 minutes on YouTube and you’ll find that not only is Alonso even more fond of the middle finger, most of the grid have flicked it at one point or another. Jacques’ just being a sore hypocrite.

            1. @mnmracer Ah, so he did, thanks.

              But as you say, it’s not as if Alonso hasn’t done the same. Though I’m sure Autosprint didn’t call Villeneuve up so he could point that out…

              And I still can’t get on their website and apparently it’s down for everyone else too.

            2. @keithcollantine
              this is the right link it’s working but the interview is not available on the website it is available on the Magazine

            3. @tifoso1989 Thanks for that.

          2. @keithcollantine He was waving middle finger at Narain. But generally both Alonso and Vettel are experts at waving hands. Can’t see anything wrong with this though

          3. Who cares about JV’s opinion? I do, And obviously mags like Autosport… and does he not write for F1Racing too?…not to mention he was involved with Sky in Montreal”s coverage this year. I think his opinions are always relevant and compelling and he is not that far removed from F1, and still knows many many people there who respect his talents and abilities highly, such that I’m sure just because we didn’t see SV use his middle finger other than once, JV probably knows and has heard first hand tales of SV’s less public behaviour. JV is not in the habit of making stuff up without there being some sound basis for his opinion.

            And I think he is right compared to FA especially, as JV is doing. I too think FA deserves the title more, such has been his lesser car and his nose to the grindstone attitude. Not that SV doesn’t have some of that too, but JV is just saying he is less mature, and he also calls him an ace and practically unbeatable when leading.

            I also love JV’s incite into Adrian Newey.

      2. Totally agree. When I read the title I said oh no! Villenueve it’s giving his opinions again someone turn off the microphone. His opinions are totally irrelevant. At least Lauda still involved in F-1.

        1. Come on, about 50% of the people on this forum have the same opinion as him on this topic.

          1. The other 50% know that Alonso has his hand outside his cockpit constantly to complain about someone else as well. Just in Abu Dhabi he complained about Webber, wasn’t he? Instant-message to Charlie Whiting whenever something does not go according to plan.

            JV is allowed to have his opinion (we’re allowed to call it wrong). Vettel might as well overreact on some things, but comparing him to Alonso and using Alonso as a prime example of an adult person when it comes to F1 racing is so blatantly idiotic, I’m pretty sure that Villeneuve has slept through the last 7 years of F1.

            1. “I’m pretty sure that Villeneuve has slept through the last 7 years of F1.”

              You mean like when he put a group of backers together 4 years ago and made a bid in Paris to the FIA to enter F1 as a team that planned to use the then still relevant Toyota chassis? Probably the last chance that chassis had of being used. Yeah…sounds real sleepy to me.

      3. @fletch
        It’s irrelevant who cares or not what JV has to say. What’s important is that this time JV simply nailed it. Vettel has long way to go to reach Alonso level of perfection and only when he does that, he may be worthy enough to drive for Ferrari.

        1. And performing a Shumi style “from the back” twice in one race didn’t show that level of perfection?
          They both have 2 wdc’s so different styles can be equally successful.
          Both in my opinion are completely worthy of the wdc this year so it’s a win win for me.

          1. One and a half at most, not twice :p

          2. “And performing a Shumi style “from the back” twice in one race didn’t show that level of perfection?”

            rofl what? twice in one race? he made up a couple of places on the slowest cars on the grid, then crashed himself, then benefitted from multiple smashes infront and a nicely timed second SC just after he pitted for new tyres?

            1. And inbetween that needed to have excellent pace and pass guys like Button, Schumacher and Grosjean. Neither “perfect” nor what you’re describing.

            2. Oh yeah, he did overtake that guy with the slow McLaren, that old fellow who came back to race for his grandchildren and the nutcase. Good job, Seb! Very impressive.

            3. @flig – The same Mclaren car that was leading the race from pole? The same Lotus car that won the race? As I said, he wasn’t perfect, but I don’t know what you’re playing at trying to discredit his drive.

            4. Yeah, it is the same car, just as Mark Webber had the same car as Vettel, but you wouldn’t praise someone for overtaking Webber as much as you would if he pulled that move on Vettel. Well, maybe you would; I wouldn’t.

            5. @flig – Button may not be as fast as Hamilton, but so what? His car was fast and the driver is a WDC.

        2. Perfection?

        3. @commentadore

          Ummm… Yes, because the driver who has basically dominated the sport for almost 3 years, is going to be a triple world champion this year, and who rarely makes mistakes really needs to prove worthy to a team who haven’t had a truly competitive car since 2008, whose technical department can’t get a wind tunnel working, whose overall boss is a raving, deluded lunatic, who can’t run two drivers in the same team, and whose attitude to the sport is one of entitlement and petulance…..

          1. They are the most successful team in the history of the sport(not only formula 1). They are the 7th brand of sports that produce more money when formula 1 is 11 (they produce more money then formula 1 itself). They are the team which every driver form 11 years to 80 years dream to drive for including Vettel: adn including Hamilton:,50580.html. They are the most supported team in the world (except England) in all the countries. They have always the best driver on the grid driving for them. Maybe they will not win every year (i don’t think that they are even interested in that) but they are always there for the win in the top 3 teams.I can write a book for the records of Ferrari and what they are capable. Like in all the sports in the world there are always some people(small number) that dont like them ( hate!!) but unfortunately for them, they are hating the best.

            They will win this year the World Driver Championship.

            1. They will win this year the world drivers’ championship.

              Sorry to be pedantic, but no they won’t. We can say that with absolute certainty.

              Fernando Alonso might win the drivers’ championship, and he may do so driving a Ferrari, but Ferrari cannot win a drivers’ championship any more than Red Bull or McLaren can.

              Ferrari may win the constructors’ championship but they need to take 82 points off Red Bull with 86 available so it’s not looking likely.

              Maybe they will not win every year (i don’t think that they are even interested in that)

              I doubt it, and I’m sure the same goes for McLaren and Red Bull as well.

            2. The winner of the world championship driver it’s a price that go to the driver and the team, if Alonso wins the winner is Fernando Alonso driving for Ferrari. Do you believe that in 1999 and 2008 Mclaren didn’t win nothing? But strange in both those years they were the team who celebrated most in the end,when Ferrari was disappointed in the end even they win both WCC??They weren’t happy.

              “I doubt it, and I’m sure the same goes for McLaren and Red Bull as well.”

              No. You have to look at the percentage of success. Ferrari percentage is higher in terms of race winning than Mclaren. Bear you in mind that Ferrari has 16 WCC double of Mclaren 8.
              Red Bull have to pass 15-20 years in formula to be compared. We can talk by let say 2025 what they have done…Personally i doubt that they will stay more than 7-8 years as they relate only to publicity.

            3. Lewis Hamilton’s success in 2008 and Mika Hakkinen’s in 1999 certainly reflected on McLaren and was in part due to their efforts.

              But did McLaren literally win the drivers’ championships in those years? No, obviously not. Just as Williams did not in 1982 nor Lotus in 1968 nor Ferrari in 1961. These are random examples but you could choose any season (though we could nit-pick over 1966!)

              All I’m saying is, a drivers’ championship victory is credited to the driver and a constructors’ championship victory is credited to the constructor. If that weren’t the case then there would just be one championship instead of two. That’s why the constructors’ trophy has the constructors’ badges on it and the drivers’ trophy has the drivers’ names on it.

              If Ferrari were “disappointed” in those years it’s a reflection on them and their priorities, not the championships.

      4. I don’t care about JV. But I agree with him in this last rant of his.

        I still think Alonso’s mentality is far ahead of the competition. He’s always there to give 100%, and makes the most out of the situations.

        Vettel on the other hand, seems to struggle when things are not going well. It’s no surprise Webber usually fights evenly with him in the first bit of the championship, when the car is yet to be fully developed.

        Don’t get me wrong, Vettel’s a hell of a driver, and I belive Alonso’s attitude is the consequence of 11 years in the sport, plus one as tester. Experience matters a lot in that respect, and both Hamilton and Vettel have been around for 6 years (5 and a half in Vettel’s case), and they almost instantly jumped on very competitive cars.

        1. Alonso constantly complains to Charlie Whiting whenever something happens. He constantly waves his hand around at other drivers. Not to mention his little shenanigans from a few years back. Then comes his and Hamiltons never ending babbling about how Vettel is only fast because of car and they’re actually fighting Newey and all that childish talk I would expect from a teenager soap opera and not the highest form of motorsport.

          Sure enough, Vettel doesn’t react as mature as people expect him to, but using Alonso as an example is rather stupid.

    3. Great comment from James Hunt about De Cesaris!

      JV is ridiculous, but he is right on that point. Rare thing.

    4. Very surprised the FIA did not renew Gary Hartstein’s contract. I feel like he has been doing an excellent job, and he was trained by one of the best.

      1. I think it might possibly be to due to his openly political stance on twitter

        1. @zubair380 What’s he been saying? I do follow him but can’t say I noticed anything.

          1. He quite often criticises the GOP. I remember there being a tweet or two about the recent presidential elections and how the republicans should stop being obstructionists.. or something along those lines.

    5. Fred Phelps was probably bored.

      1. Bob (@bobthevulcan)
        15th November 2012, 2:10

        Innovative hate-monger Fred Phelps

        First time I’ve ever heard someone call him “innovative”…

        1. @bobthevulcan Innovation level: Newey>Boeing>Go Kart>HRT>Cheese>Dirt>Fred Phelps

          Unless of course he’s being praised for having an issue with just about anything you can point your finger at.

          1. Adrian Newey is innovative at aerodynamics. Fred Phelps is innovative at hate-mongering. This isn’t exactly praise.

    6. Once again, controversial Jacques Villeneueve has now became even more controversial. J controversial V has controversially stuck his somewhat controversial neck out and controversially stated than Sebastian Vettel is controversially still a child.

      1. A person can only create so much controversy before they stop being controversial and start being incredibly dull. I think Jacques Villeneuve crossed that line a long time ago.

        1. Indeed IIRC it was right about when he joined BAR right after he dyed his hair yellow (because THAT was so cool )…

    7. This quote from Christian Horner:

      His only successes have come with Red Bull.

      Could just as easily be used as a reason why Vettel might want to leave his team.

      1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
        15th November 2012, 1:06

        yeah but look at it from Red Bull’s point of view. Vettel brings them millions. Of course they can rise Vettel’s wage if necessary but that should include Newey, Rocky and Horner. That’s a team that rocks together.
        Like Schum days. He stayed in Ferrari because, Todt, Byrne and Brawn were there and the formula worked well. Schum retired just 2 years after being defeated. It was probably a matter of age, but why didn’t he stay? It’s like Hamilton or Alonso would retire now just because they weren’t champions for 2 years in a row (and if Alonso doesn’t clinch it this year it would be another “almost” and 6 years without another the so-wished “third” in his career.
        Vettel will stay at Red Blull as long as the team can bring him a challenger car. He can exploit the best of a Ferrari or a McLaren but he won’t probably take the risk yet.

      2. @estesark

        Good point. However I think Vettel doesn’t see that. But, he may get fed up with people reminding him that his success was only due to the fastest car.

        Just as I said about Hamilton, if Vettel wants to be remembered as a legend then he must do something exceptional. And that is to move teams (into a slower team) and become a WDC with another team. I think Vettel would struggle to achieve this. I was less than impressed with some of his performances this year when he did “NOT” have the fastest car available to him. Hamilton has a better chance, but that is all I am going to say for now. It remains to be seen.

        Schumacher was already a WDC when he came to Ferrari, and may I remind you Ferrari were slow. He remained with the “slow” team for number of years before they started winning. There was really only a few years in the 2000’s where Ferrari were unbeatable. But all the other years, Ferrari were not the fastest team on the grid. So I really would not compare Vettel with Schumacher.

        1. Jim Clark is a legend despite spending his entire career in a dominant Lotus by Colin Chapman.

          1. Sush you, do not comment on Jim Clark people might think that your making a valid point. I don’t usually post thing lik this but I found this forum post very entertaining, just look how fast it died down after OP’s comment halfway through the second page. Worth reading.

      3. Nobody has said that Vettel is not a great driver. All they have said is that Vettel may want to leave RB to stop all this “Is the car how’s winning not him” thing. That’s all!!

        He’s good. That’s for sure. Not the best in my (and many others) opinion. But he definitely has the speed. He reminds me of a (not so) young Lewis though. He needs to mature (nothing wrong with that, we all need/ed).

        I’m just looking forward for the following years. I expect Lewis new moment to help him mature and become even better. That’s what I think happened to Alonso in all those dry years. And that’s why I see Vettel leaving from RB at some point logic.

        1. I wonder how many top drivers would leave Red Bull (as it is right now) in Vettel’s place just to appease people that don’t like them. My prediction is that both Alonso and Hamilton would clutch to their seat like a new born to its mother and would try to make sure that the winning formula around them does not change.

          1. “And that’s why I see Vettel leaving from RB at some point logic.” Obviously not now! He still has a long time in F1.

    8. Those Westboro nutters leave me speechless.

      1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
        15th November 2012, 1:27

        this …-ignorant fools worship these race car drivers like they are little gods!

        As far as I concern they are racing gods. Except Narain of course :P

      2. Granted it’s hardly an exclusive crowd that the westboro baptist church will picket, but F1 should be proud to have recieved such an eloquent tirade from them.

        1. I find it easier to laugh at them for the amount of time, effort and money they waste. Even if everyone stopped what they were doing and started living as the “church” saw fit, they would still claim everyone is going to hell for not having done it sooner.

          1. Oh, definitely. You couldn’t make that screed up. God only knows where the money comes from because there can’t be anyone left in the country they don’t offend.

      3. , we will kindly warn them to flee the wrath to come

        Never thought I’d be thanking Sky for saving me from a trip to hell. Thank you Rupert Murdoch. $:)

    9. Vettel will be looking closely how Hamilton does at Mercedes, if he does well and is able to turn around that midfield team into a frontrunner I don’t see why Sebastian wouldn’t want to emulate his hero Michael. Also when you win that much you need a new challenge I guess, at least to give you credibility.

      1. OmarR-Pepper (@)
        15th November 2012, 1:52

        like loeb in WRC? He’s thinking about to retire because nobody can mess with him. Not even close.
        Yet he got 9 championships in a row!

        If Vettel can be a recordman, even if this is considered negative for the sport which wants to attract spectators by showing variety, he won’t say. “No, i won’t grab another championship here”.
        This is not a videogame where you get bored and you go from “easy” to “hard”.

        Vettel’s era is more complicated than Schum’s. Hill quit, Hakkinen quit, Villeneuve faded, and at that time Raikkonen looked as a serious menace in a joke of a car (remember his reliability problems?). On the contrary, Vettel’s racing against I’m-the-maximum-the-best-and-whatever-you-want-I-have-it Alonso, Hamilton, Button (yeah, world champion Button), and new talents as Perez or Maldonado (when he is really on, he’s talented) will try to take his crown too.
        So if you talk about getting new challenges,…. he’s being challenged all the time!

      2. Vettel has turned around a midfield team… Weren’t Red Bull (with Newey) mediocre before 2009. The rule chsnges helped, but Vettel certainly done his bit

        1. LoreMipsumdOtmElor
          15th November 2012, 7:28

          So Button has turned around Honda? Sorry mate, but the blown diffuser has turned around RB. That had nothing to do with Vettel.

          1. You just responded to a pretty inaccurate comment with an even more inaccurate comment. It wasn’t just Vettel that turned them around. It was a culmination of factors, including a potentially great team, with a great driver, another good, experienced driver and the ’09 rule changes that turned the team around.

    10. Chris (@tophercheese21)
      15th November 2012, 1:55

      I actually completely agree with JV.
      I dont hate Vettel, but he seems to get very hot headed when things dont work out the way he wants. Whilst Alonso, just keeps calm and carries on (most of the time).

      1. Chris (@tophercheese21)
        15th November 2012, 2:02

        Also, i dont know if perhaps anyone could clear this up for me, but;

        Why are there rumors about Vettel going to Ferrari all the time? I mean, what incentive is there to go there? He’s got clearly the best car under him, with the best Aerodynamisist in Newey, so why leave that?
        He’s won 2 world championships, and quite possibly going to be 3 in 2 weeks time, in a row. I cannot see why he could possibly want to abandon that success, for a team that isn’t as good.
        I understand the prestige that comes with driving a Ferrari, but i would rather drive for a team that doesn’t have as much aura about it, and win championships. Than Drive for Ferrari, and be the ‘almost’ guy.

        1. I totally agree with you. I fail to see how people can get excited when they read a rumor like that. It seems so obviously silly. Unless we don’t understand F1 of course…

      2. Whilst Alonso, just keeps calm and carries on (most of the time).

        Most of the time. Lol. Isn’t that also true of Vettel? Or Hamilton, or any other driver? F1’s the pinnacle of motor sports and watching it on the TV it looks as easy as can be — but it takes massive concentration and effort.

        I think one could say Kimi stays calm and carries on though.

        1. Chris (@tophercheese21)
          15th November 2012, 4:32

          Actually, the main time that Vettel is calm, is when he’s out front by 10+ secs.
          When he’s having to race against people, fighting through the pack, i’d say, not the majority of the time, but a good portion of the time, he’s complaining about something.

          I’m not saying that the other stars, like Hamilton, Alonso, and Button dont complain, but I just get the impression that Vettel seems to have a lot more to complain about.

          1. Yes, you are saying the other stars … “Alonso, just keeps calm and carries on”. At least own up to it when you’re (acting like) a hypocrite.

            1. Chris (@tophercheese21)
              15th November 2012, 13:58

              It’s very easy to make someone seem like a hypocrite when you quote only one part of the statement.

              As i was actually comparing them Vettel. And from what i’ve seen, Alonso, Button, Michael, etc, seem to complain a little less, and a lot less like a hot headed child.
              (i.e. WHAT IS HE DOING!!! STOPPING ALL THE TIME!!!) you get the point.

              And maybe think before you start throwing around names at people man, not cool. Things like that that make this place not nice to comment on for fear of getting flamed by people with strong opinions.


            2. @tophercheese21
              Then either you started watching yesterday, or you choose to ignore those examples. Button in Singapore was immediately on the radio in a similar situation. Alonso… well, if you truly dare say Alonso is and has been mature compared to Vettel, you truly don’t know what you’re talking about.

              If you started watching yesterday (this year), then read up before making comments like that about drivers.

            3. Chris (@tophercheese21)
              15th November 2012, 14:17

              I see your point.

              And no, i didn’t start “watching yesterday (this year)”.
              I’ve actually been an avid F1 fan since ’05.
              But because I made a “hypocritical” remark, i can see why you would question that.

              Just using this year as an example, yeah sure there have been times when Alonso (ALL THE TIME YOU HAVE TO LEAVE A SPACE!), and Button with his near constant moaning of understeer.
              And inevitably there have also been times when Vettel has been angry in his crash helmet.

              Ex. 1 – Giving Narain the finger and swearing on the radio after he lapped him in Malaysia and punctured his tyre on Narain’s front wing, when Vettel could have given him a bit more room.

              Ex. 2 – Yelling and gesticulating, when Hamilton unlapped himself in Germany, when Hamilton was within his right to do so as he was faster.

              Ex. 3 – And then the last race in Abu Dhabi with the Ricciardo incident, where it looked like Vettel was a little too agressive during the safety car period.

            4. @mnmracer Wow this is not the first time I’ve seen you resort to name calling when someone has a different opinion to yours…

            5. @tophercheese21

              Ex. 1 – Giving Narain the finger and swearing on the radio after he lapped him in Malaysia and punctured his tyre on Narain’s front wing, when Vettel could have given him a bit more room.

              I’m not sure why people keep bringing up that Vettel caused the accident or didn’t leave enough room.

              You realize Narain was given a drive through penalty, meaning the stewards thought Narain was responsible. Johnny Herbert was the driver’s steward there and he later went on Sky’s F1 Show and showed exactly why Narain was given the penalty.

              With video replays, Herbert showed that Vettel had given 1.5 meters to NK. That’s 4.5 feet — this is the pinnacle of motor sports and Vettel needed to give more room? (if Vettel knows one thing better than any other driver recently, it’s how to lap back markers). Narin then jinked to the right and clipped Vettel and, here the real key thing Herbert points out, while Narain moved right he was looking in his LEFT mirror. Not Narain’s proudest moment as a driver.

            6. @tophercheese21
              So basically you agree with me that they’re all ‘guilty’ of this behavior, and singling out Vettel is a bad case of a double standard ;-)

              Name-calling is an unwarranted insult. This is just calling things out like they are. Is calling someone a liar (not you Chris) name-calling when they have actually lied?

            7. Chris (@tophercheese21)
              16th November 2012, 6:16

              I respect your opinion, and im going to move on now because this is getting old now.


              P.S. – You used the term hypocrite incorrectly.
              You would have been right, if i were a Formula 1 driver who also complains and screams.
              But I’m not, so im not being hypocritical at all.

          2. It is quite simple. Some drivers need to ride at the back to learn how that feels. And it is not just about being in the mid-field or a backmarker; even when Vettel was driving for Toro Rosso, he was one of their pack, so he was used to running ‘in front’ of all the others. Button and Alonso spent several years chasing other cars and being involved in messy situations, that is why they are better at keeping cool and carrying on; Hamilton and Vettel do not have that, they were at top cars (in their field) for most of their careers.

            1. *one of the leaders of that pack*, sorry.

            2. Fact-check:
              Vettel spent 12 races at the back of the pack in the TR2.
              Alonso spent 17 races at the back of the pack in the Minardi.
              Button never had a car consistently at the back of the pack.

              Don’t make stuff up.

    11. Sebastian Vettel will be at Red Bull in five years, hints Christian Horner (Daily Mail)
      “Sebastian has been involved with Red Bull since he was 12 years of age. His only successes have come with Red Bull. He feels comfortable in the environment. He trusts in the people and we’re bringing the best out of him as well and he is happy”

      It’s funny I remember reading an article just under 5 years ago after Lewis Hamilton won the 2008 World Championship:

      Lewis Hamilton will be at Mclaren in five years, hints Martin Whitmarsh
      “Lewis has been involved with Mclaren since he was 12 years of age. His only successes have come with Mclaren. He feels comfortable in the environment. He trusts in the people and we’re bringing the best out of him as well and he is happy”

      Five years later and Hamilton will be at the grid of the Australian Grand Prix for the 2013 season opener in the seat of a Mercedes!

      I guess all you can say regarding Vettel and RedBull is anything can happen in five years… and we’ll see in 2017.

      1. Vettel isn’t as … how to put this politely … “blinkered by his own mirror” as Lewis, I don’t think.

    12. Keith, why are you giving Fred Phelps publicity? He’s hateful scum that doesn’t deserve the attention he and his ‘family’ want.

      1. Chris (@tophercheese21)
        15th November 2012, 4:36

        The world would be a better place if that family ceased to exist.

        1. I disagree. To ignore people’s opinions would be the greater sin, whether we agree or not. Ignoring things doesn’t make them go away.

          1. Bob (@bobthevulcan)
            15th November 2012, 7:43

            There’s a line between stating and substantiating a personal opinion, and outright hate speech. Picketing soldiers’ funerals by hurling abuse at the bereaved, anti-semitism, and other incendiary acts that the family has done, crosses that line by a long shot.

          2. Chris (@tophercheese21)
            15th November 2012, 14:21

            @Alex Brown

            Actually I think in this case ignoring them is the best possible solution, because all they want is attention from the media, it’s how they make their money.

            But they’re so hard to ignore because of the completely asinine, hateful, and ridiculously ignorant things they say.

            1. Let him rant on all he likes. Even this negative publicity he gives F1 seems to be at least the only publicity the Austin GP get in the USA.

      2. @driftin So that no one is in any doubt he and his family are hate-filled scum.

    13. Looking through pictures on Facebook and noticed that Vodafone has opted for their US branding of Verizon on the McLarens this weekend.

      1. Verizon-Vodafone Mclaren Mercedes – for one race only:

        1. QuantumForce42
          15th November 2012, 8:33

          Gotta admit. The Mclaren looks better with that branding on..Putting Vodafone there just makes the car look like there is a hole on it’s sidepods..Never been a fan of this livery. West colours were better..

          Also miss the Petronas Sauber and HSBC Jaguar. Petronas are now sponsoring Merc and the car looks good, especially with eye catching helmets (hope someone changes helmet designs next year)..Caterham is green but it looks more like a banana..

    14. Should the Westboro Baptist Church interfere, send in Louis Theroux. He’ll politely chase them away :D

    15. I liked reading that interview with Epstein. He might not be a racer, but if that helps him look out at what fans want and make him pay that little bit more attention to get them back next year, it could be a blessing in disguise!

    16. Regarding Vettel, I could live with the finger, it is after all just a ‘one’ sign. But that stroking the bull really makes it hard to keep on liking him…

      1. Although it would be funny if Alonso popped out a tiny carrot to feed his little horse…

    17. Auto Motor und Sport claim Toro Rosso will join Red Bull in using Renault engines from 2014:

      1. According to Autosprint Ferrari hopes to get Force India as a replacement of Torro Rosso who will join Red Bull using Renault engines

    18. All drivers will react when something goes wrong, so not surpsied tbh

    19. I will not take team radio as proof that “Vettel reacts like a child”. Because every driver has had such team radios, Hamilton’s “stewards love me” in Monaco 2011, Alonso’s “All da time you haf-ta leave the space” to Rosberg and “you keep talking to Charlie about Hamilton” at Valencia 2010, Button’s “What an idiot” to Kobayashi. Team radios are heat of the moment reactions and they can be immature.

      But outside the car, Vettel behaves very well. I haven’t seen him blame Red Bull for the Abu Dhabi fiasco or for the race ending car failures in 2010. The one incident that Vettel “reacted like a child” is Turkey 2010 where he actually failed to realize his mistake outside the cockpit too.

        1. I +1 your +1 good Sir

    20. Haha, de Cesaris hasn’t been out of the pits for 10 seconds in the video, and already James Hunt’s getting stuck into him! Nice shots from the back of his car.

      Nasty surprise about Gary Hartstein. It sounds like he was pushed, and I haven’t found any more on it yet – smells like FIA trying to bury bad news. Pretty shabby treatment of a guy who’s been a worthy successor to Sid.

    21. No I’m totally with Villeneuve on this one. I mean, Vettel, ok, so he holds the record for the youngest person to score championship points, lead a race, win a race, and score pole position, and became the world’s youngest world champion one year, and the world’s youngest double world champion the next year, and looks likely to be the world’s youngest triple world champion in the next few weeks. Yeah, ok, so he may well have won over a quarter of the F1 races he’s taken part in, scored 35 career pole positions to date and proved his quality by helping win the Nations cup in the annual Race of Champions for the past five years running, I totally accept all of that. And off the track, yes, ok, I accept that he’s probably one of the most entertaining, erudite people when giving interviews, and has a tireless work ethic which sees him visiting the factory more often than virtually any other driver on the grid, and made him the only driver to bother paying a visit to Pirrelli to speak to them about the new tyres, but having said ALL OF THAT, I think he’ll never really be a decent racing driver while he still get occasionally hot headed when talking on the radio or reacting in the heat of the moment.

      And while we’re talking about people who are overrated, what about Jesus, yeah? I mean, ok, sure, he cured the blind, walked on water, fed the masses with a loaf and a fish, while spreading a message of tolerance, charity, and forgiveness, which has inspired some of the greatest acts of compassion in human history, but I ask you this – would he have been able to do any of those things without being the son of God? I know it’s very easy to criticize Judas for what he did, but he never had any of the perks from which Jesus benefitted. Frankly, with God as a parent, virtually anyone would have been able to accomplish what Jesus did. And that’s before we even start on how he conducted himself while nailed to the crucifix. All that whining and moaning, that’s when we see his true character. Sure, it’s easy to look good when there’s nobody able to stop you from performing miracles, but look at how he acts the moment that someone so much as drives rusty iron spikes through his hands and feet before hoisting him 20 feet into the air to die a slow and agonising death. For me, I don’t really see how anyone can take him seriously as a Messiah until he proves he can perform miracles without Divine assistance, and conduct himself in a calm and dignified manner while suffering one of the cruellest methods of execution ever devised.

      1. @MazdaChris After comparing Vettel to Jesus, I’m afraid you’re on Mr. Phelps’ black list, just below gay F1 fans.

        1. @girts Hey, anything which aligns me against hardline religious nutjobs is fine in my book.

          But my point, if perhaps lost a little in sarcasm, is that it doesn’t really matter how good you are, or how successful, there will always be people out there looking to discredit your achievements. In the case of JV, it sounds a lot more like sour grapes than anything else. Hopefully Vettel just does what everyone else does, and tunes his critics down to mere background noise. Frankly, if I were Vettel I’d just be like “I’m sorry? No, sorry, I can’t hear you over the noise of HOW AWESOME I AM!” and that would be that.

          1. “Frankly, if I were Vettel I’d just be like “I’m sorry? No, sorry, I can’t hear you over the noise of HOW AWESOME I AM!” and that would be that.

            Yeah that would really show the world his maturity and endear everyone to him.

            I’m sure SV will not be affected one iota by JV’s opinion, as it is merely that…an opinion… and needn’t be over-reacted to. He also calls SV an ace and unbeatable when leading. How that discredits his achievements is beyond me. But I guess it’s just an opinion that should also be discounted given the source. In fact SV is no ace and is highly beatable when leading. The horror…the sour grapes…

        2. @MazdaChris Yeah, I got your point, well written.

          Vettel sometimes looks like a character from the Looney Tunes to me but that doesn’t diminish the value of his great achievements. I believe that Vettel’s role in leading the team and the development of the car is often underestimated, too.

          I also don’t think that Alonso is more mature than Vettel.

          1. @girts

            Well, I wouldn’t necessarily disagree that Vettel isn’t as mature as Alonso, but then Alonso is 31 and Vettel is 25. Who wouldn’t, looking back, say they were less mature in their 20s than their 30s? But I don’t know that I agree that Vettel’s occasional hot headedness is specifically an issue of maturity, rather a difference in character between the two men. Some people are quick to react while others are more measured, and those traits tend to stay with them for life. Maybe Vettel will cool down a bit as he gets older, but I don’t think he necessarily needs to in order to be successful. In fact, he definitely doesn’t, after all he’s already way more successful than Villeneuve ever was. So by what measure if Villeneuve in a position to criticise? And what exactly is JV suggesting that Vettel stands to gain by ‘maturing’ in the way that he suggests? Vettel is already nearly a three time world champion, and there’s every likelihood that this time next year we’ll be talking about him winning his fourth. When Vettel eventually hangs his helmet up and retires at some point in the future, he’ll look at his enormous trophy cabinet, think about all the records he’s broken along the way, and he’ll look back on this point in his career when he was apparently ‘too immature’ and I wonder, will he have regrets about it? I suspect not, personally.

            JV also blatantly twists the truth. He says that Vettel “lost control of his car and crashed” while under the safety car. That’s not the case at all. He didn’t lose control of the car, he took avoiding action. Yes, avoiding action because he wasn’t paying enough attention to the driver in front, but that’s very different to losing control. And he hit a foam track marker, which he wouldn’t have hit had it been two metres up or down the road. The only reason it had any consequences at all was because the wing was already damaged. So to point this out as some kind of justification for calling him immature is ludicrous. A bit absent minded, perhaps, but it was a split second mistake which circumstance happened to turn into something with more severe consequences. It was, in actual fact, a bit of bad luck. Something you really can’t account for, unfortunately.

            Don’t get me wrong, I’m not one of the hordes of Vettel lovers who think he can do no wrong; he can get even stronger in the future. But you really can’t argue with the results he’s generated so far in his career.

            1. I think JV is a proven WDC who is merely providing his opinon on SV’s maturity level vs. FA’s…and many seem to agree with it. I don’t see anywhere where JV is diminishing SV’s accomplishments other than when he points out the reality of how SV had a ragged portion of the race and safety car help when he came from the back of the pack in the last race. Nor do I see how the count on SV’s success, be it by numbes or age, diminishes the fact that JV is also a rare WDC owner who had a good car for 2 years and nearly came out with 2 WDC’s, in his rookie and second years in F1, having come from winnning CART rookie of the year and then the Championship and the Indy 500 in his second.

              He also calls SV an ace, and says he is practically unbeatable when leading. Just that he doesn’t keep as cool a head as the likes of FA right now, and JV respects FA more and thinks he deserves the title more, no doubt in JV’s opinion because he has shown maturity in spite of having to live with a lot of frustration in a lesser car while at the same time bringing it down to the last races with SV. And when SV reaches that level of maturity I have no doubt that then when he is asked to provide his opinion on SV at that time, he will acknowledge that SV has matured. I don’t see the big deal or the controversy nor the need for the diatribe of sarcasm.

      2. Brilliant comment. If I hadn’t lost my imaginary hat would have taken it off for you;)

      3. @mazdachris
        Haha! Fantastic comment! : )

      4. @mazdachris LOL great comment

    22. I only found this link to Polish F1 talks for it so far, but the FOTA Austin forum video footage offers some real nuggets.

      My Favourites are in the discussion about the KERS/Hybrid in the first panel, then Heikki mentioning his greatest moment in Racing, i.e. beating Schumi in the ROC. Oh, and his answer to what he will be doing next year and on going for an overtake make me pretty sure he won’t be racing next year.

        1. @bascb did you get video? I get only sound and a black picture…

          1. worked for me, yeah. I did have to reload it at least once between watching the different video’s though @mustalainen

            1. @bascb hmm, okay. Lets hope it will find its way onto youtube later

            2. @mustalinen, or maybe try and view it on the polish site I found it on first, that one works, although it seems they have the 2nd part 2 times and hte 3rd part is missing.

      1. Maybe the best part is the 3r. I love the way Hulme describes the “Ballbreaker first corner”, the wide corner 2 and wide hairpin bound to tempt drivers to all sorts of stupid moves!

      2. Have a look at those @keithcollantine and anyone from the US, at about 30 minutes into the panel 3 video Hulme gives some information on what NBC are planning for next year, he goes on to say that today there will be more known. Almost as if he is part of that deal.

        1. sorry what David Hobbs says

    23. american media not reporting anything about the race, if your not an f1 fan here in the us you won’t know the race is on-

    24. I think that we need to take the Villeneuve interview with a bit of perspective. Slating him for his sad end to his career is easy. He obviously wasn’t an all time great and had he started his career in a McLaren, for example taking DC’s place then F1 would be a very different place I imagine. However, we must remember that this is an interview with an Italian publication regarding a Ferrari driver. We must also remember that his father is the most loved Ferrari driver ever. He was never going to side with Vettel.

      With regard to Vettel staying with Red Bull in five years, I think this is wishful thinking at its pinnacle. Alonso and, to an extent, Hamilton joined McLaren for their love of Senna. Neither had any qualms admitting to this. Vettel, as a German, growing up in the heyday of Schumacher must have positive feelings to the Maranello. No driver would turn down Ferrari. And in all honesty, we don’t know what the next bubble will be and how the teams will react to the engine changes. Even the gear ratio limitation and inevitable consequential penalties will shape future championships. While this is no doubt the Newey era, it will pass. Nothing is more certain than that.

    25. He speaks the truth, Vettel is very much like a child when things don’t go his way. I think we’ll hear some very interesting stories that show Vettel in a different light from his friendly ‘tv’ persona when he leaves Red Bull.

      1. He speaks the truth, Vettel is very much like a child when things don’t go his way.

        So are the much older guys like “hafta”-Alonso and “what an idiot”-Button.

    26. JV is really just getting more and more dreary.
      I will admit that Vettel have acted childish at times, but how is Alonso any better?
      Alonso is a lot older then Vettel and has a lot more experience so everyone would expect a difference in their behaviour. Anything else would be unnatural really.
      But you don’t have to go far back to see the childish Alonso either. The Bahrain GP and his comments about leaving a space. In the heat of the moment, I accept that, but hardly the most cool headed team radio I have ever heard. Another is Valencia 2010 when Alonso kept raving about where Hamilton where after he felt he was robbed by the SC-line. If he was as mature as JV suggests, then he would have got his head down and worked with what he had instead of complaining.
      Then “this is ridiculous” in Germany 2010 when Massa defended the lead.
      Or weaving his hand at Petrov after Abu Dhabi in 2010, and his comments afterwards suggesting that other drivers shouldn’t get involved in the title fight.
      Then lets not get into details with 2007, that would take WAY too long.
      And in his Renault days he was also quite fond of the middle finger.
      My point is, I agree that Vettel can be childish at times, but then to use Alonso as a yard stick.. That is what gets me. To me, it just doesn’t make sense. Yes Alonso seems like the most cool headed of the current top drivers, but he has also been through a lot more then both Hamilton and Vettel and the latter, I think, isn’t far off him right now. Considering how Alonso has acted, even after he had been crowned a double world champion, then I don’t think that you can hold it against Vettel. To me, Vettel actually seems more cool headed now, then Alonso did when he was the reigning back to back champion.

      1. I think 2007 can be summed up with qualifying in Hungary (IIRC), where Alonso threw a fit and wouldn’t let Hamilton box during qualifying. The points he lost there, with the 5 place grid penalty, were enough to make him WDC.

        Yes, cool and calm Fernando, tossing his toys and a 3rd WDC out of the pram. Haven’t seen Vettel do that.

      2. @mads…JV is using FA as a yardstick because it is he that is vying for the title this year with SV, and nobody else. Why wouldn’t Autosport ask him about these two drivers at this stage of this season?

        Did you notice you are actually agreeing with JV?

        “I agree that Vettel can be childish at times”

        “Yes Alonso seems like the most cool headed of the current top drivers”

        So JV is more a FA fan. Many are. What’s the big deal? He even calls SV an ace and practically unbeatable when he leads. JV’s is not asking that SV’s wins and WDC’s be repealed. ie. he isn’t diminishing SV’s accomplishments…just prefers FA’s maturity level and no doubt the fact that he has kept a cool head…no doubt from he himself also maturing over the years such that he has been cooler with a much more frustrating and lesser car than SV has had this year. I think of it like JV is pointing out SV has had less to complain about car-wise, and yet when the chips have been down SV has shown a level of maturity that JV knows is below what some display in their careers. JV too no doubt matured over the years…we sure know he has seen the highest highs and the lowest lows F1 can provide, including his father’s death, so I think JV has all kinds of street cred (read track cred) to provide an opinion on what he likes to see in a driver when asked.

    27. For all those taking the truth of JV as gospel as it relates to Vettel’s behavior, they then need to digest this little nugget and it’s implications:

      “Many just draw him [Newey] as a genius, while that’s just a part of his immense power of team leader,” he said. “He isn’t a know-it-all who creates a winning car and pretends that anyone wins with it.

      “In truth he is perhaps the humblest technician, the one that listens more to his drivers. The years and wins gone by haven’t changed him: he never pontificates, he holds talks.”

      JV says Newey relies on a lot on driver input. Hmmm. And folks says Newey tailors the car to Seb’s style, and hence Seb’s input. Must mean with the successes the RB 5-8 have had, Seb has helped developed the best car of the last 3.5 years. Not sure what Hamilton or Alonso have been doing ;)

      Jacques says it, so it must be true. (and I’m sure no one can actually deny that Newey works exactly as JV indicates.)

      1. Jacques says it, so it must be true.

        Taken out of context, one would instantly assume it was said with a veeeeery healthy dose of irony ; )
        But you are probably right that on that subject he might actually know something.

        1. JV saying AN listens to the drivers moreso than other technicians, and JV would know, does not equate to SV developing the best car. It equates to AN surrounding himself with the TEAM which includes SV and MW, and they all devolope the car, as opposed to him being a prima donna and dictating the way it will be.

    28. Villeneuve’s an idiot.

      Remember Vettel’s what, 25? He’s still incredibly young in comparison to the likes of Alonso, who was also hot-headed back when he was young, as most young drivers are while still maturing. Alonso has had his silly outbursts this season also, should people have already forgotten. These drivers are designed to win, and they will turn around and say something daft whenever things don’t go right for them, like it was with Hamilton last year, Alonso in 2007, and Vettel at times this year. So what? Do you expect them all to be absolutely calm 24/7 when they have so much media attention surrounding them??

      1. JV is no idiot…he is a proven WDC and someone who knows a ton more about F1 than most, and has provided his opinion when asked by Autosport, who obviously value his experience. I’m sure JV would acknowledge that we all mature with age. He is speaking of the current setting as FA and SV sit vying for the WDC this year with two races to go. The only two contenders for it. And he happens to be more for FA, as are millions. What’s the big deal? He’s not asking for SV to hand back his successes…just saying that he sees room for SV to mature. And SV likely will, and I’m sure if at that time JV is asked, and I think they should keep asking him given the interest his comments generate, I’m sure JV will acknowledge that indeed SV has matured.

        1. @robbie

          provided his opinion when asked by Autosport, who obviously value his experience

          He was asked by Autosprint, not Autosport.

          And I don’t think it’s outrageously cynical to suggest that what they valued was not so much his experience as the opportunity to write a story heavily critical of Alonso’s main championship rival.

          1. Hmmm…ok. Don’t know why it says near the top of the page “Villeneuve (Autosport)” then. Perhaps that should be changed.

            Also, I don’t see how JV is being ‘heavily critical’ of SV. Sure he gives him a shot, but he also calls him an ace and almost unbeatable when he leads a race. At the same time I don’t see JV putting FA on a god-like pedestal…he just thinks he has kept a cooler head when if anyone should have lost it a few times for having a lagging car it should be FA.

    29. I guess F1 should be honoured that the Westboro folks are going to try and upstage the race. Only the best events are guaranteed that level of idiocy.


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